Digital transformation is something affecting the vast majority of businesses and to compete effectively employers need to attract, develop and retain people with the right digital skills. But what digital skills are most in demand and should recruiters be looking for people who already have them or for people with the potential and ability to learn them?
To give some cutting-edge insight into this topic, my guest this week is Brian Hickey, European MD of Udacity. Udacity partners with industry-leading companies to develop “Nano Degrees” for in-demand digital skills.
In the interview we discuss –
• What is driving the market for digital skills
• Which digital skills are most in demand and how demand is changing
• Why not all digital skills are technical skills
• How is technology changing the way we learn
Brian also shares his thoughts on whether it the responsibility of the employer to train employees or the employee’s responsibility to keep their skills up to date
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Transcript:
Matt Alder [00:00:00]:
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Edward Dias [00:00:25]:
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Matt Alder [00:00:48]:
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Matt Alder [00:01:23]:
Hi everyone, this is Matt Alder.
Matt Alder [00:01:25]:
Welcome to episode 148 of the Recruiting Future podcast. Digital transformation is something affecting the vast majority of businesses and to compete effectively, employers need to attract, develop and retain the people with the right digital skills. But what digital skills are in the most demand and should recruiters be looking for people who already possess these skills or people with the potential to learn them? To give some cutting edge insight into.
Matt Alder [00:01:55]:
This topic, my guest this week is.
Matt Alder [00:01:57]:
Brian Hickey, European MD of Udacity. Udacity partners with industry leading companies to develop nanodegrees for in demand digital skills. They even have one dedicated to flying cars.
Matt Alder [00:02:14]:
Enjoy the interview.
Matt Alder [00:02:16]:
Hi Brian and welcome to the podcast.
Brian Hickey [00:02:18]:
Thanks Matt, great to talk to you.
Matt Alder [00:02:20]:
Pleasure to have you on the show. Could you just introduce yourself and tell everyone what you do?
Brian Hickey [00:02:24]:
Sure. So my name is Brian Hickey. I am the Managing Director for Udacity in Europe. So for a little bit of background before that I was working with Justit for five years running their Irish business and then later on roughly half of their international business. And I spent some time as CEO of a beauty on demand business in the UK and then joined Udacity in May 2018. So not that long ago and very happy to be their first Managing Director in Europe and very much focused on building out our presence in Europe and delivering on our mission to democratize education and generally increase people’s access to tech skills.
Matt Alder [00:03:10]:
Fantastic. Now there may be some people listening who’ve not heard of or not come across Udacity. Could you give us a little bit of insight into what the company does.
Brian Hickey [00:03:20]:
Yeah, happy to. So Udacity are. So we’re a global online learning platform. We connect digital education to jobs and we provide students with the skills they need to advance their careers. As I mentioned, our mission is to democratize education and empower people to learn the skills they need to take their careers to the next level. We provide what we call nanodegree programs, which are project based online courses that cover a whole range of subjects from software engineering to self driving cars, data science, digital marketing, AI and robotics. So these nanodegrees are a little bit different from I’m going to say traditional online programs in that we build them in partnership with some industry leaders. So some of those leaders would include Google or Facebook, Mercedes Benz, Nvidia. So we build our nanodegrees with these companies and what that means is that our students are benefiting from the most relevant content and the kind of the content that employers value the most as well. So we work with some big enterprise clients, some of the names I’m sure you’d recognize, to help them upskill their employees and teach them the skills they need to weather that digital transformation. And some of those clients include Deloitte, Audi, IBM, Bosch, BMW, Deutsche Telekom. And this goes on and on. And typically then our students are working professionals. Most have a college education already and they’re just looking to advance or sometimes even change the careers. So just in terms of numbers then, we’re about 450 employees in total around the world. We’ve got operations in Brazil, China, Germany, Egypt, India, uae and soon we’ll have an additional one in Ireland as well.
Matt Alder [00:05:26]:
So there’s a, there’s a kind of a massive focus on digital skills and digital talent and how people can reskill and upscale and how companies can support them. And we’ll sort of go in and talk a little bit more about that in, in detail as we get into the conversation. But as some context, you know, why now? Why is this happening now? What are the sort of key drivers that are leading to this sort of change in thinking around. Around skills and the skills that are needed?
Brian Hickey [00:05:56]:
Yeah, it’s a good question. I think what we’ve seen is that every industry is undergoing digital transformation. I mean, we get asked questions about what are the sectors that you guys work in the most. And there used to be specific sectors maybe a year or two ago, but now we’re noticing this in every single industry. And I think this transformation is being driven by changes in how consumers actually behave. So how we order food, how we Transact financially, how we consume media, how we travel, how we work, where and how we source products. It’s all changing continuously. And every time something changes, it means some fundamental changes to how businesses find their customers, how they market to them, how they manufacture for them. So all in all, it means huge operational change for these companies. And obviously companies are trying to stay competitive all the time. And you know, they’re under pressure to find cheaper, faster, better ways to get their products to markets. And technology plays a huge role here. And that’s really where we come in. We help those companies to upskill their teams and their staff to make sure that they have the best people with the best skills and they remain competitive all the time.
Matt Alder [00:07:13]:
So we sort of talk about the best skills and digital skills. What do we actually mean by that? You know, what are the sort of the skills that are most in demand at the moment and how’s that changing and how’s it likely to change in the future?
Brian Hickey [00:07:32]:
Yeah, I mean, I think the ones that are most in demand, I think there’s two ways of looking at it. There’s the more traditional ones and then there’s the emerging areas as well. So when I say traditional, some of the trends that we’ve seen is that we have a huge amount of graduates who maybe took one of our developer nanodegrees in the last couple of years and now they’re progressing onto more specialist nano degrees in response to how employers are hiring and how the market is changing. And what I mean by that is they’re taking nano degrees in self driving cars or machine learning and even flying cars as well. So I think what we’re seeing as well is that more and more people are appreciating how these new technologies and when I say new, I mean kind of moving away from the typical kind of engineering nanodegrees that we may have provided. People are kind of starting to appreciate and understand how these new technologies are being applied. And we’re seeing huge interest in some of what we would call the more specialist areas. So the ones like blockchain, nanodegrees, artificial intelligence, VR developer. So we see this trend continuing and interestingly, we see some very traditional sectors getting on board as well. So by traditional, I mean sectors such as retail and pharmaceutical are investing in upskilling their teams in areas like AI and blockchain. We’ve seen a lot of demand for robotics coming through from the automotive sector and even from the financial sector, which, which I guess you could class as a traditional sector. We’re seeing a Lot of demand coming through there for one of our more recent nano degrees to launch, which is our AI for trading.
Matt Alder [00:09:12]:
So I’m going to resist the temptation to ask you for more details about your nano degree in flying cars and sort of, sort of dig a bit deeper into digital transformation because obviously, you know, digital skills, technical skills, it kind of goes without saying that, you know, they’re needed in the sort of economy that we’re moving to. But are there, you know, what kind of skills do companies need for digital transformation that are sort of non technical? You know, what are your sort of thoughts in that area? What are you, what are you seeing?
Brian Hickey [00:09:47]:
Okay, so aside from the more I’m going to say typical technology programs like the engineering ones I referred to, whether it’s web development or intro programming or Android development, what we’re seeing now is a huge demand for nano degrees such as digital marketing and for data science. So in the case of digital marketing, for example, as I mentioned, we’ve got a lot of demand coming through from sectors such as retail and pharmaceutical. I think quite honestly that’s because they are starting to firstly change how they try to reach customers. So they may have used some traditional platforms previously and now everything is moving to digital. So that’s the way they’re going. That allows them to be a little bit more efficient and also track exactly what they’re spending money on. So digital marketing is proving very, very popular in some of those more, in some of those big, more traditional sectors. And we would classify that as a move away from the kind of core tech nanodegrees that we provide. Another one we’re seeing huge demand for is our data science nanodegrees. Now, data science can be taken at various different levels. There’s a foundation level data analytics all the way through to the kind of more specialist nano degree in data science. But we’re seeing massive demand coming through here for data science from some surprising areas. So some of the big consulting firms are starting to book many of their employees in also again, back to retail, automotive as well. And I think data science has been used in lots of interesting ways. So again, not a core tech nano degree as we would classify it, but certainly something that you need to have if you want to make better use of your information, if you want to understand more about how your customers are behaving or shopping, and if you want to retain those customers and keep them coming back, you need to make better use of the information that you have. And so data science is now becoming one of the most popular nanogries that we have. The last one, then again, is that I touched on earlier on, is the AI for trading, which we’re seeing huge demand for across the financial services sector as well. So there are some of the non core tech nano degrees that we’re seeing big demand coming through for.
Matt Alder [00:12:11]:
Obviously, technology is changing the way that people learn. What kind of lessons have you taken from that?
Matt Alder [00:12:21]:
How are people learning differently?
Matt Alder [00:12:23]:
What sort of tools and techniques are most useful for people looking to upskill or reskill themselves?
Brian Hickey [00:12:31]:
Of course, Yeah, I mean, I think how people learn is changing all the time. A little bit. Like consumer behavior, it never stands still. So what we’ve seen is online learning is quickly becoming the norm. But that said, students want a slightly more engaging experience than simply watching a video. I would also say if we’re looking at kind of trends or patterns, I would say that students are also a little bit more price sensitive or price savvy and most definitely time sensitive as we all are as well. So they have access to tons of information, they can do their research, and with that they’re demanding the best content that can be made available to them. But the main thing we’re seeing with students is that they want to be able to learn on their own terms at a time that kind of suits them. But while they want that, they also don’t want to be completely isolated. So if you go to university, you’re with a bunch of other students and you benefit from the engagement that goes with that. One of the downsides of traditional online learning, I’m going to say, is that you can feel a little bit isolated. And this is really one of the things that sets Udacity apart. So we speak to our graduates and our alumni quite a lot to try and gain some feedback into what they enjoyed most and what they valued most and what we can develop further. And what they’re telling us is that they love having access to the most relevant content. And the reason we get that is because we’re working with the likes of Google and Facebook and Amazon to build out these nano degrees. So it’s only the most cutting edge skills that we’re teaching. Students are also telling us that they love the flexibilities that our nanodegrees offer. You know, you get to learn whenever it suits you at a time and a place that works for you. They enjoy the project based nature of our courses and that’s extremely important in terms of you’re not just watching a video, you are working on real world projects that have been set and defined by a Mercedes Benz or a Facebook or an Nvidia or whoever helped us to build that particular nano degree. Our students like the opportunity to engage with other students, and they get to do that because they’re part of a classroom, an online classroom environment. They have access to other students all over the world taking the same nano degrees, and they have access to our project reviewers, and they have access to our Udacity mentors who are helping them with any problems that they might have. So that engagement piece is huge for them. But they also want the opportunity to do things on their own terms, and they enjoy the flexibility that goes with that. So there’s some of the patterns that we’re seeing in terms of how learning is changing, and specifically online learning is changing, too.
Matt Alder [00:15:19]:
So, final question, and I know something that is very relevant to all the recruiters listening to the show. Whose responsibility is facilitating learning? Is it something that employers should be doing to reskill the workforces that they have, or is the onus on the individual to make sure that they have the skills that are right for the economy they’re trying to work in?
Brian Hickey [00:15:47]:
I think it’s a little bit of both. I think it’s a little bit of both and more. There’s also an argument to say that government should be facilitating learning as well, to a degree, and some governments are better than others at that. But in terms of, you know, whose responsibility is it between employer and the employee? I think it’s both. I think on the employee or the individual side, you know, in order to graduate, you need to commit some time. And ultimately, what we see is students who are more likely to graduate are the ones that have decided to invest in themselves. They believe in lifelong learning and the benefits that it brings, and they want to progress their career. Career on the employer side, I think we’re getting to a place where employers are, it’s fair to say they’re obliged to facilitate learning if they want to attract and indeed retain some of the best talent. If they want to remain competitive, that’s something that they need to do. They need to have the best talent on board. But I would also say that it shouldn’t really be seen as an employer’s responsibility or an obligation. It should really be seen as a huge opportunity. And what I would say there is that companies who invest in their staff, we know they attract great people, and that gives them a significant advantage from day one. What companies sometimes forget is that there’s a huge cost benefit to upskilling or reskilling existing staff, as opposed to Hiring new if you hire new staff, it takes a couple of months, it soaks up resources and it costs a hell of a lot of money. And there is still quite a degree of risk because you don’t know if you’re going to get the right hire even after they’ve been. So there is a time and a cost benefit there in terms of upskilling your own staff as well as some of the other benefits like employee engagement and loyalty. So we know this firsthand because at Udacity we have an enterprise team who help clients, I guess, firstly by trying to understand what their upskilling requirements are. We provide a detailed assessment of their employees to understand their skill levels, capabilities and at what stage they should be joining various different nano degrees. And then we provide some tailored learning packages for those clients and that includes class mentors and project reviewers and also reporting so that employers know how their employees are getting on because most of them want to understand how can we support them more and how can we help them get to that graduation place. So I think it’s an obligation for the employer, but I think the individual needs to commit as well and understand that there is a time requirement there. But also ultimately a little bit of time and a little bit of support from an employer or an online learning provider such as Udacity will give them a great chance for graduation.
Matt Alder [00:18:40]:
Brian, thank you very much for talking to me.
Brian Hickey [00:18:42]:
Thanks, Matt.
Matt Alder [00:18:44]:
My thanks to Brian Hickey. You can subscribe to this podcast in Apple Podcasts or via your podcasting app of choice. The show also has its own dedicated app, which you can find by searching for Recruiting Future in your App Store. If you’re a Spotify user, you can also find the show there. You can find all the past episodes@www.rfpodcast.com. on that site, you can subscribe to the mailing list and find out more about working with me. Thanks very much for listening. I’ll be back next week and I hope you’ll join me.
